"christian" is essentially only a term. it was invented by the world, not by the saints, nor God. and you can tell it's just a term rather than a real name, because of how the word is formed. "christian" - "christ" "ian" - follower of Christ. it's really not meaningful, it's just a term. like American. it just means "person of america" and it doesn't really have meaning.
but what i mean is that God never ever meant for us to go by "christian" or to call all of this "christianity" - as "christian" is only ever used in the Bible when speaking of the world's point of view on the saints, and "christianity" isn't even in the Bible. but rather God meant for us to be saints, which is a meaningful word in the Bible 101 times, versus the meaningless term "christian" in the Bible only 3 times.
the word saint means separated to God. so if you are a saint, you are not a mere person, you are not of this world, you are separated from this world and you belong to God.
what do you guys think of this?
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18 replies on this topic
PutHisBloodOnIt - 9/2/11 @ 12:40 PM
I really don't care about terms or technical terms there is enough bickering among the body of Christ we have a lot of bigger issues to tackle that's just my opinion.
Jordan Dean - 9/2/11 @ 12:52 PM
Actually, the first time the term "Christian" was ever used was in the book of Acts which was invented by Peter. Does that not count as coming from God since all Scripture is inspired by God?
Ariel - 9/2/11 @ 1:24 PM
The way I see being called a Christian is this: people created this term, correct? Because they saw these people following Christ, they saw them living their lives for them. Isn't that a good thing?? That's how it's supposed to be! That's what a Christian is! Someone who lives for and follows Jesus Christ, not just someone who "believes" in God. I'm touched when people say that they see God in my life, when they can tell by my actions that I'm a Christian, that's what a real Christian is. I'm not going to honor myself or put myself any higher by calling myself any different than a Christian; someone who lives for and follows Jesus Christ
Jordan Dean - 9/2/11 @ 1:48 PM
@Jake - Peter literally said Christianoi which means "follower of Christ" in his language which translates to Christian in English which literally means the same thing.
Thirst - 9/2/11 @ 3:46 PM
Unless you're going to start a new denomination, does it matter?
Spirit in the Sky - 9/2/11 @ 5:04 PM
I am gonna stick with what the BIBLE refers to followers of Christ : Christians. Period.
AudioOutlaw - 9/2/11 @ 5:32 PM
In all honestly, do you spend your time trying to come up with new topics to post here and try to trick people to call them wrong? I'm really not trying to be mean, but it LOOKS like this is the case. I normally stay quiet on this forum, but I just thought I would ask this.
This topic is a small meaningless topic. There is more we can be doing than talking about this. We could be called Johns, Franks or even Jimmys, but what we are here for still remains the the same; to be servants of Christ.
Also, if you're so concerned about worldly things that other people are doing, I suggest you get off the internet and the computer. Both are worldly.
I'm sorry if I come across as abrasive or just plain mean, but seriously.
daniel@seekGodnow.org - 9/3/11 @ 5:47 PM
@PHBOI, you may not care but what if God does? what if Jesus does? what if Jesus preferred we were bolder to say we were His disciples, rather than just some other religious group? (ie all the other isms, ians, etc) - because, if we call ourselves christians, that makes Christ sound like just some other dead leader of people who choose to follow him/his example, ie buddhists following buddha, lutherans following luther, but Christ is alive and teaching us today, isn't He?
@jake, it isn't up to you or to me what we are called. we should go by what the Bible calls us. and it never anywhere calls us christians, nor does it have the word "christianity" in it anywhere. this words are terms, they aren't meaningful, and "christian" is an adjective (ie christian book, christian movie, christian shirt).
@jordan dean, would you please provide scriptural support for what you first said?
Jordan Dean - 9/3/11 @ 7:15 PM
@Daniel - Acts 11:26 "And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called CHRISTIANS first in Antioch." If you have a copy of the New Testament in it's original language and understand it, you will see Christianoi directly translates to Christian.
Other later verses where Peter used it include Acts 26:28 "Then Agrippa said unto Paul, Almost thou persuadest me to be a CHRISTIAN." and 1 Peter 4:16 "Yet if any man suffer as a CHRISTIAN, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf."
If you don't like the term, you'll have to take it up with Peter.
And in defense of PHBOI, if God had a problem with it then why did He "inspire" Peter to use it?
And in defense of Jake, it does call us Christians (refer to verses above).
Read the whole Bible before assuming what it does and doesn't say.
daniel@seekGodnow.org - 9/4/11 @ 6:53 PM
@jordan, I would appreciate it if you reviewed how you spoke toward me before we continued the discussion about "christian." I am not interested in what unedifying things you have to say about me personally, but about what edifying things you have to say about the topic
Jordan Dean - 9/4/11 @ 8:55 PM
Nice attempt to maneuver around everything I said but I think this discussion is over unless you have anything more solid than scripture. And I didn't say anything about you personally btw, I just answered your question with a Biblical answer.
daniel@seekGodnow.org - 9/6/11 @ 12:02 PM
@jordan dean,
well i saw your topic about how you want certain people to admit it when they see they are wrong. i wanted to take more time in writing my reply but lately, with the new school year starting and stuff, (my first year of community college), i don't really have tons of time to do so, so i will try to respond to things but much more simply.
first, i don't believe you are accurate in saying that peter invented the term, for 2 reasons: 1. Acts is not written by peter, but by luke, and 2. Acts does not say that the disciples called themselves christians, but that they were called christians. if the disciples go to the park, and htey are called Jesus freaks, does that mean that suddenly they take on that title and go by that? but the text doesn't say that they called themselves that. it only says that they were called that.
second, in the verse actually having something to do with peter, he is saying "as christians" - 'as', means not exactly but like. like, "as a bird," or "as the wind."
and also, there is a wealth of information that argues my point:
first the Bible commentaries/encyclipedias:
Richard Watson, Watson's Bible Dictionary (1832), p. 233. -
"Christian: A follower of the religion of Christ [Note carefully that Christ never started a religion - John 7:16]. It is probable that the name Christian, like that of Nazarenes and Galileans, was given to the disciples of our Lord in reproach or contempt. What confirms this opinion is, that the people of Antioch in Syria, Acts 11:26, where they were first called Christians observed by Zosimus, Procopius, and Zonaras, to have been remarkable for their scurrilous jesting. Some have indeed thought that this name was given by the disciples to themselves; others, that it was imposed on them by divine authority; in either of which cases we should have met with it in the subsequent history of the Acts, and in the Apostolic Epistles, all of which were written some years after; whereas it is found but in two more places in the New Testament, Acts 26:28, where a Jew is the speaker, and in 1 Peter 4:16, where reference appears to be made to the name as imposed on them by their enemies. The word used, Acts 11:26, signifies simply to be called or named, and when Doddridge and a few others take to imply a divine appointment, they disregard the usus loquendi [established acceptation of the term] which gives no support to that opinion. The words Tacitus, when speaking of the Christians persecuted by Nero, are remarkable, "vulgus Christianos appellabat," "the vulgar call them Christians." Epiphanius says, that they were called Jesseans, either from Jesse, the father of David, or, which is much more probable, from the name of Jesus, whose disciples they were. They were denominated Christians, A. D. 42 or 43; and though the name was first given reproachfully, they gloried in it, as expressing their adherence to Christ, and they soon generally accepted it."
Ethelbert William Bullinger, A Critical Lexicon and Concordance of the English and Greek New Testament (1908), p. 152. -
"Cristianos, Christian: a word formally not after the Greek but after the Roman manner, denoting attachment to or adherents to Christ. Only occurs as used by others of them, not by Christians of themselves. Tacitus (A.D. 96) says (Annals 15, 44), "The vulgar call them Christians. The author or origin of this denomination, Christus, had, in the reign of Tiberius been executed by the procurator, Pontius Pilate."
Thomas W. Doane, Bible Myths (1882), page 567, note 3. -
"This name (Christian) occurs but three times in the New Testament, and is never used by Christians of themselves, only as spoken by or coming from those without the church. The general names by which the early Christians called themselves were brethren, disciples, believers, and saints. The presumption is that the name 'Christian' was originated by the heathen."
Easton's Bible Dictionary. -
"The name (Christian) given by the Greeks or Romans, probably in reproach, to the followers of Jesus. It was first used at Antioch."
and then online articles:
http://www.auburn.edu/~allenkc/openhse/christian.html
http://ecclesia.org/truth/christian.html
http://www.jesusfamilies.org/hot_topics/christian.htm
and then a couple commentaries on in 1 Peter 4:16
Vincent's Word Studies -
A Christian
Only three times in the New Testament, and never as a name used by Christians themselves, but as a nickname or a term of reproach. See on Acts 11:26. Hence Peter's idea is, if any man suffer from the contumely of those who contemptuously style him Christian.
Jamieson-Fausset-Brown Bible Commentary -
16. a Christian-the name given in contempt first at Antioch. Ac 11:26; 26:28; the only three places where the term occurs. At first believers had no distinctive name, but were called among themselves "brethren," Ac 6:3; "disciples," Ac 6:1; "those of the way," Ac 9:2; "saints," Ro 1:7; by the Jews (who denied that Jesus was the Christ, and so would never originate the name Christian), in contempt, "Nazarenes." At Antioch, where first idolatrous Gentiles (Cornelius, Ac 10:1, 2, was not an idolater, but a proselyte) were converted, and wide missionary work began, they could be no longer looked on as a Jewish sect, and so the Gentiles designated them by the new name "Christians." The rise of the new name marked a new epoch in the Church's life, a new stage of its development, namely, its missions to the Gentiles. The idle and witty people of Antioch, we know from heathen writers, were famous for inventing nicknames. The date of this Epistle must have been when this had become the generally recognized designation among Gentiles (it is never applied by Christians to each other, as it was in after ages-an undesigned proof that the New Testament was composed when it professes), and when the name exposed one to reproach and suffering, though not seemingly as yet to systematic persecution.
i hope you will reconsider your stance on this matter
daniel@seekGodnow.org - 9/7/11 @ 4:12 AM
@audio outlaw,
they do not say that the Bible is wrong. however, my next point would be that "God's Word" is not the Bible.
@jordan dean,
i didnt say we are never called christians in the Bible, i said that the Bible (ie the Bible itselff) does not call us christians, but it contains accounts of the disciples being called christians.
I didn't say the word christian wasn't in the Bible. I was the first to mention it is in the Bible 3 times.
I didn't say it was an adjective *only*.
if you'd like to compare Acts 1:1 and Luke 1:3, you will understand that the author of Luke was the author of Acts, and we know Luke wrote Luke, and we know that peter did not write Luke.
AudioOutlaw - 9/7/11 @ 11:58 AM
I will no longer reply to this thread, this is ridiculous. Also, you can take up the written Word of God with all "non-false prophecy" pastors.
Again, don't even worry about replying to this, I'm not coming back to this thread.
Spirit in the Sky - 9/6/11 @ 3:47 PM
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jake - 9/6/11 @ 3:52 PM
Daniel,
1... Why? Is that all necessary? Bro, we don't have time.
Just admit when your wrong man. What difference does it make? I am a follower of Jesus Christ. Am I not going to heaven according to you, or whoever wrote those Bible commentaries?
Why are you so concerned with categorizing and labeling? That is what Satan does. He puts things into categories and boxes, and Jesus sets them free... Stop serving Satan.
Jordan Dean - 9/6/11 @ 7:34 PM
@Daniel - You said we are never called Christians in the Bible. (Acts 11:26) You are wrong. You said the word Christian is never present in the Bible. (Acts 11:26) You are wrong. You said Christian is an adjective only. (Acts 26:28) You are wrong. You state Luke wrote Acts. That is debated and not a proven fact.
Have nothing to do with foolish, ignorant controversies; you know that they breed quarrels. 2 Timothy 2:23
I will no longer reply to this pointless, foolish, ungodly thread.
AudioOutlaw - 9/6/11 @ 9:48 PM
Something I noticed is that it seems like you are putting commentaries OVER the Word of God.
And if those commentaries are saying that God's own Word is wrong (I didn't even bother reading the whole post due to ridiculous length, I'm just going off of what I see) then that right there is wrong.